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Reynolds |
IS THERE ANY EXPERT COMMITEE ATTACHED TO YOUR FORUM , WHO LOOKS INTO QUESTION AND ANSWER TO QUESTIONS WHICH ARE PUT IN THIS FORUM . SOME 2 YEARS BACK QUESTIONS ARE NOT ANSWERED YET . PL DO IMPROVEMENT IN THIS AREA .
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Pascal |
Both Bud and Peter want to be the "one man commitee", and for prestige they fight. They forget to focus on others questions and answers, even in their own thread. A forum like this is one of the most powerful online tools there is. To get several, worldwide, expert answers and opinions within less than 24hrs is fantastic. We should show it the respect it deserves. I think many "experts" are scared away from all the "kids in the sand box" discussions we have here. I can't wait until these forums have an online chat line with web cam, then members can use private chat for their personal vendettas. I wish there where a few more international hydraulic forums available. That would improve the overall quality. To bad, some of the best hydraulic engineers in the world, like swedes, germans, and japanese, are to busy to spend time in forums like this. A forum doesn't need a commitee of experts. A forum IS a "commitee" of "experts" and others, that want to learn and improve. All with their own opinions, their own way to show respect, and their own way trying to help and answer questions with a positive attitude. It's obvious that the teaching skills decrease when the "expertice" skill increase... If you cant see it, you can't describe how it works, so people can understand. Please try to attach a picture if you cant describe. Use the snipping tool in Windows Vista. In a couple of seconds you have a jpg pic that explain more than thousand words...snippingtool Like this If there are question not beeing answered, I think it is questioners responibility to re-ask the question once. Then it's ADMIN's or MODERATOR's responibility to bring that question up front again, if questioners repeatedly fails to get an answer... Happy Thanksgiving I just got some coffee with freshly baked cinnamon rolls Per A "aw come on" Ps. Sorry for the editing, just made some english improvements. This message has been edited. Last edited by: AKKAMAAN, |
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Bourdon |
mbsahoo asked:
That situation is part of the problem with Forums such as this one. I try to answer any and all questions to the best of my ability but also leave unanswered any questions I don't feel I know enough about to give good feedback. Would it be possible for you to take on this lack on the Forum and answer the questions that don't get an answer for 5-10 days???? Or at least acknowledge the poster and advise them their questio is important and is being pondered at least by you. Actually I was unaware there were any unansweeed question. Bud Trinkel FP Consultant Retired "It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes. A principle which if acted on would save one-half the wars of the world. "Thomas Jefferson" |
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Darcy |
Check out hydraulicanswers.com
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Bourdon |
Peter: All Both of the dedicated fluid power persons are on there, What do you expect, miracles????? Look at the Fluid Power Societies Forum or any of the other Fluid Power Forums and you will see a similar situation!?!?!?!?!?!?! Bud Trinkel FP Consultant Retired "It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes. A principle which if acted on would save one-half the wars of the world. "Thomas Jefferson" |
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Darcy |
Peter:
Thank you for your comments. hydraulicanswers.com will be popular when visitors realize that their engineering questions will be answered without a product bias. I always read your articles and you obviously are very bright. I would love to use you as a resource for possible posts. The discussion can then stay on the topic. (An Answer) |
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Bourdon |
Peter replied:
"Peter: All Both of the dedicated fluid power persons are on there, What do you expect, miracles????? That didn't make sense." It's a Play on Words statement Peter. You would have understood "All ten of the----" The way it was stated was to emphasze the meager respomse to any thing Fluid Power. Peter also wrote: There seems to be little interest in engineering on this forum but it is well suited for finding parts and getting log splitters to go." I wonder if the lack of interest is due to the fact that so few know enough about Fluid Power to get much past (1) Pump, (1) Valve, (1) Actuator Log Spliter circuits and even those they as simple questions about. I don't see such simple questions on the Electrical Forums where TRAINED/DEDICATED Persons are asking and answering questions well above the simple and not so simple information the Posters have already learned from 2-4 years of intense schooling. The answers come from TRAINED/DEDICATED Electrical types that are not afraid someone will steal their fancy circuit since almost everyone on the forum could design that circuit with ease. You still have not convinced me that there is no need for Fluid Power Engineers and Maintenace persons. The more I see Log Splitter and Where doI find---- questions the more I see a need for better training than is available to anyone wanting to learn the Hydraulic and Pneumatic regimen. Oh well Someday Maybe??????????????????? Bud Trinkel FP Consultant Retired "It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes. A principle which if acted on would save one-half the wars of the world. "Thomas Jefferson" |
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Bourdon |
Peter's reply to my poat on TRAINED/DEDICATED Fluid Power Persons
I took the "PLC" Forum to be an Electrical Forum that Trained Electricians frequented. Many of the post's have little to do with the working of a PLC. I don't believe anyone TRAINED in Fluid Power is less dedictated, in fact they are probably more dedicated to seeing Fluid Power come out of the Dark Ages and into the light of the 21st Century. And, take the TRAINED to mean the 1-2 week seminars or the College of Hard Knocks that most Fluid Power persons attended. You were more fortunate than many in the Fluid Power field since you had some rigourous training in the Electrical field and applied the similarities of the two. Over the years I have had many Electrical Engineers and maintenance persons in classes. After they understod that NC and NO were reversed in Fluid Power operation and I started using "Normally Passing"and "Normally Non-Passing" they learned quickly since the two fields function the same in many aspects. I believe that is why you see the Electrical Forums have a lot more participation from a lot more persons when anything to do with Hydraulics or Pneumatics is posted. I also believe that stems from the fact that the electrical type can diagnose a failed system and show the electrical signal to perform a function is where it should be even when the circuit has stalled at that juncture. Even you say you had to learn Hydraulics to show how the UNTRAINED or COLLEGE OF HARD KNOKCS TRAINED Mechanical Engineers or Maintenace persons were screwing up the circuit so your controller could perform as requested. However, I do believe you are more correct about there ever being TRAINED/DEDICATED Fluid Power persons. At least I tried and it has been interesting, to say the least, to see how much Negative feedback and how little Positive replies the subject has generated. I'm ready to get on the band wagon for MechaFluiTronic Persons so no one can point fingers when a machine stops running. Oh well, I tried, I think???????????? Bud Trinkel FP Consultant Retired "It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes. A principle which if acted on would save one-half the wars of the world. "Thomas Jefferson" |
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Bourdon |
maglub, that is where you learn on the job without any knowledgeable person advising or training you. You take some parts and try to get the results you want without really understanding what the parts are capable of doing. Another way of saying the same thing is when someone says I found out how to do that by the "Trial and Error Method." Fortunately the T&A Method sort of works for Fluid Power since no one gets electrocuted like in the Elecrical field. And, I've seen several trial and error attempts come up with some great ideas that I had never thought of. Unfortunately you CAN GET HURT with Fluid Power equipment but usualy not catastrophically unless you get a Body Part under a high force cylinder or try to stop a high torque Air or Hydraulic Motor with your hand. Bud Trinkel FP Consultant Retired "It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes. A principle which if acted on would save one-half the wars of the world. "Thomas Jefferson" |
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Bourdon |
That seems to be the thiinking if the MAJORITY maglub. That is also the reason the TRAINED/DEDICATED persons from other ways of transmitting and controlling energy are taking over a lot of Flud Power applications. Hydraulics may be siimple to understand but understanding Hydraulics and applying it can be a daunting task. Just ask Peter about the messes he has to untangle that were caused by the SIMPLE UNDERSTANDING Persons that tried to make an actuator move without out enough Flow and/or Pressure to meet the Force and Speed requirements. Needless to say, Peter loves to straighten out those screw-ups and take home a fat check for his expertise. I don't expect to live long enough to see TRAINED/DEDICATED Fluid Power persons since only a skinny minority think it is a good idea. However, I am not smart enough or just too stubborn to give up hope that there will be TRAINED/DEDICATED Fluid Power persons that will move Fluid Power out of the "I want to use ANYTHING except that Smelly, Leaky, Hot Runing, Jerky Hydraulic Equipment." Oh Well, Someday Maybe??????????????? Bud Trinkel FP Consultant Retired "It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes. A principle which if acted on would save one-half the wars of the world. "Thomas Jefferson" |
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Bourdon |
BTW maglub, I am one of those who came through the College of Hard Knocks since I started selling Fluid Power equipment in 1966. I quickly learned the way to sales was designing circuits to meet a customers needs and I was off and running.
Tried a lot of ideas over the years, a lot worked, some did'nt, some were old tried and true others were my Brain Storms. They are all in a Circuits Design book I used to teach an advanced Fluid Power class. You can see it on the home page of this forum at the "Ebook" Link. It is only partially presented so far but you can see the Table of Contents listing to get an idea of what it contains. There is also a section of unusual circuits at the end that show some of the College of Hard Knocks experiences that I have experiened. Bud Trinkel FP Consultant Retired "It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes. A principle which if acted on would save one-half the wars of the world. "Thomas Jefferson" |
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Pascal |
Why does it matter who "get the job done"? Industri obviously/certainly don't care. Big Corporations, like john Deere, Eaton, etc, have there own internal education. It's a matter of supply and demand. If dedicated FP people can do it, they'll do it. If a electric engineer can do it he'll do it. If you want create a level FP people, it gotta start some where local. The whole USA is way to big of a cake to bake as a starter. Get started locally. After a while others will follow, and after 5-10 years the will be a nationwide certified standard for FP dedicated people. Start setting up seminars and classes around a local mechanical college. Engage a local Association for FP. Plan courses, certificates and get it started. I've seen college of Sascatchewan giving a nice cluster of FP courses for different levels. Even college of Tampere, Finland are going on with it. A college in Sweden started up with the Swedish Association for Hydraulics and Pneumatics. Here is their course plan: Basic1 4 weeks Basic2 4 weeks Assembly tech Basic1 4 weeks + 2 weeks = 6 weeks Maintenance tech Basic1 4 weeks + Basic2 4 weeks = 12 weeks Engineer/designer Basic1 4 weeks + Basic2 4 weeks + 6 weeks = 14 weeks All levels with Certification, even the total net 20 weeks. Student need different levels of expeience in industri to get certicate. Minimum is 2 years. I think this program is mostly for the stationary industri. Sorry website for this program is only in Swedish Per A aw come on.....force makes it go....or slow.... |
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Pascal |
WOW I love that site, Thanks Peter! Happy X-mas too! Per A aw come on.....force makes it go....or slow.... |
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Bourdon |
AKAKAAMAN: Are these 40 hour weeks? If not what is the total Class room Time in Hours? Thanks: Bud Trinkel FP Consultant Retired "It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes. A principle which if acted on would save one-half the wars of the world. "Thomas Jefferson" |
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Pascal |
The University/College system in Sweden, grade all earned courses/classes/degrees etc in points. To become a Doctor you have to earn about 220+ points. 1 point is supposed to equal 1 week of full studies. It can be ten 40min classroom hours and a LOT OF HOME WORK, or 40+ classroom hrs. Some times it can be 40 hrs in classroom PLUS a lot of home work. It depends on the character of the subject. If you already have the skills or knowledge, you can test to earn your points and go ahead with next class. That way you can skip classes you don't need. I would think these hydraulic courses are almost 100% classroom and hands on hydraulic lab/shop based, and home work on top of that. Home work is, many times, for students that can't follow the pace, which usually is problems with the math understanding. This certification program is made for people with a minimum of 2 years hands on experience, so a lot of the basic classes is just a test process. The grades for each course is -failed -3 -4 -5 To get certified you need at least 4 in average. If this college could offer this class on distance, I'll go for it in a heart beat. I'll check it out.... Per A aw come on.....force makes it go....or slow.... |
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